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Letters to the Editor: April 10, 2008
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Letter of the Day: Bright idea?
Editor, Daily News:
To the driving public:
Is it too much to ask that you turn on your headlights when it’s dark outside? Or when it’s raining outside?
All it would take is a few roadblocks set up on Pine Ridge and Airport-Pulling roads in North Naples to stop this dangerous problem from continuing.
Once you get a ticket for not having your headlights on, you’ll never forget to turn them on again.
Hit these drivers in their pocketbooks and the roads will be safer for all of us.
Eric Gross, Naples
Letter: Leading the band
Editor, Daily News:
Finally! Somebody else is aware of the drivel that is printed in our Daily News by columnist Barbara Bova.
Thank you, letter-writer Susan Rustad, for getting on the bandstand and trying to do something about a columnist who wouldn’t have a chance at doing what she’s doing if her name wasn’t Bova. There are still many more readers who consider her “not so hot” (the word I want to use may not be printable).
Bova is under the impression that what she writes about has never happened to anybody else, only to her. I wish for all of us that other readers of the Daily News would tell the Daily News that Bova should be dropped from writing her drivel.
But whatever you do, leave her husband, Ben, to continue to write about the scientific things that are interesting.
Does she actually get paid? If so, we all deserve a discount!
Give that space to columnist Brent Batten or to one of your employees who is looking for a break.
Dan B. Goldstein , Naples
Letter: Bedeviled
Editor, Daily News:
Re: “Jesus Christ Superstar.”
I had never seen the stage production or movie and had been looking so forward to seeing it at the Philharmonic Center for the Arts.
Unfortunately, it went totally unappreciated since the sound level was so unbelievably loud. I missed 90 percent of what was being sung.
It seems unconscionable that the sound cannot be better monitored. To overpower these obviously wonderful voices with loudness of the orchestra was inexcusable.
As well, a more traditional versus modern version of the production would have been far more appealing.
I was extremely disappointed and came away wondering why I went.
Joan O’Connor, Naples
Letter: Sharing, caring
Editor, Daily News:
Scouting for Food drive: A big success.
On March 1, the Boy Scouts of America held its annual canned-food drive to benefit St. Matthew’s House, Catholic Charities, Shelter for Abused Women and Children and Grace Place for Children and Families, at Lowe’s in Naples.
We would like to thank Lowe’s for the use of its parking lot as our food-collection site. Lowe’s is truly a friend of our community!
Thanks go to each agency that provided personnel to help sort and box the food, the boxes, tape and markers — especially St. Matthew’s, which also provided us with tables and chairs.
We would also like to thank the many Cub Scout packs, Boy Scout troops and Venture crew that collected approximately 12,000 pounds of food!
Big thanks go to Troops 2 and 707, which provided us with dining flys to shelter us from the sun; Pack 12, which provided the grill to cook lunch for the participants; and Marie and Emily Janasik, who served as our chefs for the day!
We appreciate the hard work of our Scouting for Food chairperson, Colleen Freedman, who organized the day’s events! This gave everyone (both agencies and Scouts) an opportunity to do a good turn and help to feed the hungry in Collier County.
Units participating were: Packs 12, 21, 25, 38, 165, 168, 234, 242, 243, 325, 339 and 2002; and Troops 2, 165, 243, 274, 951 and 325.
Michelle Suppes, Alligator District Committee member, Boy Scouts of America
Letter: Follow the oil money
Editor, Daily News:
Exxon Mobil and Chevron-Texaco made obscene profits last year.
In the meantime, Americans are paying an average of $3.30 for a gallon of gas. These immoral American oil companies should be punished — taxed to death!
But before rushing to judgment, let’s analyze the situation.
Today, oil sells at $104 oer barrel, and 70 percent of the oil consumed in the United States is purchased outside the country. There are 42 gallons in a barrel, so the purchase price of crude is $2.48 per gallon.
Furthermore, the average state and federal tax on gas is 42 cents per gallon. So the cost to the oil companies is $2.90. This leaves 40 cents per gallon to bring it from Saudi Arabia, Nigeria, Venezuela — or wherever — refine, distribute and market it, and make a profit for millions of American stockholders, while paying federal income tax!
So, internationally, Exxon Mobil made $10 billion on $100 billion sales in one quarter. Big news, but this is only a 10 percent return on the investment, less than many other industries, such as pharmaceuticals at 27 percent.
The inescapable reality is that oil is getting more difficult to discover and expensive to produce. This latest oil price inflation, contrary to the 1973 oil crisis, reflects the difficulty and cost of finding new reserves, not OPEC political pressures.
The price of gasoline in America is half of what it is in other industrialized countries, all of which incidentally have prices controlled by national oil companies where taxes are a euphemism for profits.
So don’t kill the goose that lays the gold eggs!
Georges Pardo, Naples
Letter: Pier point
Editor, Daily News:
I’ve lived near Vanderbilt Beach almost 40 years.
We don’t need the “Frank C. Halas” fishing pier as a legacy (read albatross) for District 2.
The traffic at Vanderbilt Beach is already excessive.
As for the letter writer who suggested The Ritz-Carlton, Naples could benefit from a pier, an acquaintance commented to me, “How many people do you know who stay at the Ritz carry bait buckets?”
J. Paul Jodoin, Naples
Letter: Job well and quickly done
Editor, Daily News:
The old is again new. The consecration of the oratory at Ave Maria completes the town that will be known as a learning center and a place to live and pray.
This reminds me of Santiago de Compostela in Spain, a medieval town with its university and cathedral, where Europeans have gone on pilgrimage for centuries.
Ave Maria is not a throwback to medieval times, but the same idea that straddles the centuries and makes Floridians find a link with the past while looking towards the future.
The dream that Thomas Monaghan had, together with the help of Collier County, became a reality in less than a decade — a 21st-century feat, to say the least.
Congratulations are in order for all those who contributed to the dream and, henceforth, it will be in the hands of the university community and townspeople to nurture it.
Diana L. Judith, Naples
Letter: Man of peace
Editor, Daily News:
Capt. James T. Bush, U.S. Navy retired, passed away on March 28.
Jim had a distinguished career in the Navy and was commander of a nuclear submarine capable of firing Polaris missiles. He was a hero of the cold war as he commanded one of our nuclear deterrents which became part of the doctrine of mutual assured destruction.
His experiences in the Navy convinced him that the huge arsenals of nuclear weapons on both sides were sheer madness. He then became a man of peace and worked to bring about the SALT (Strategic Arms Limitations Talks) treaties that led to the destruction of many of these weapons by both sides.
He served as president of the Naples Council on World Affairs and was active as a military advisor to Business Leaders for Sensible Priorities.
I was privileged to have known him as a friend, tennis player, poker player and chess player.
One day he confided in me that one of the things that he was most proud of occurred when Red China threatened to invade Taiwan. The United States responded by placing the 7th Fleet in the straits between the two rivals. Tensions grew and escalation appeared on the horizon. A shooting war with all of its implications was a strong possibility.
At this point, a high official of the Chinese government approached him unofficially and asked him to act as an intermediary with our State Department. The result was that both sides cooled down on the rhetoric and de-escalation and calm ensued.
Stanley Tralins, Naples
Letter: ‘They’ are amazing
Editor, Daily News:
Is it not amazing that the people who have been claiming President Bush is a “dictator” and has “too much power” are now arguing over which of the two candidates for president can promise to take over the greatest amount of control of the economy, the health industry, confiscate the largest amount of your earnings and expand the powers of government in every way possible?
Is it not amazing that certain individuals count every casualty in Iraq but fail to mention that more troops died during Bill Clinton’s years than under those of Bush? Perhaps they don’t even know! Certainly the media won’t inform them.
Does it make sense that “they” say Republicans want to “take away” Social Security when it has been the Democrats who:
1. Started taxing Social Security payments.
2. Started giving Social Security to immigrants moving to the U.S. who had never paid into the fund
3. Eliminated the income tax deduction for Social Security, and
4. Took Social Security from the independent Trust Fund and put it into the General Fund?
Bush wanted to save the system by allowing participants the option of voluntarily putting a small part of the tax into private investments. Who blocked this? The Democrats!
When the Bush “tax cuts for the rich” — which were supposed to cost the treasury “immeasurable losses” — actually resulted in record increased revenues, does it make sense to reverse them resulting in the largest tax increase in recent history which will hit everybody who actually pays any tax?
Donavin Baumgartner Jr., Naples
Letter: No alternatives
Editor, Daily News:
I respectfully ask readers to write members of Congress to stop all the farcical, feel-good statements about investing your taxes in alternative fuels that will supposedly solve greenhouse gases and appease the environmental tree-huggers and polar bear habitat protectors.
It will cost more than drilling to create such alternatives and take 20 or more years to show the public benefits of cost and return on investments that will not guarantee Earth will be cleaner.
We have the ability to convert clean coal now, but we don’t. We can have our own oil and natural gas from Alaska within seven to nine years, create thousands of related taxpaying jobs and the bears will love the heat from the pipes.
By the way, I love the bears, but they can’t create jobs.
The minute Congress passes the bill to drill, OPEC will see our intention and they will start to increase production and drop prices. They need us and China to keep their fortunes coming.
Gov. Charlie Crist should also look at those who are drilling within the 90 miles between us and Cuba. If Florida’s budget is so tight, why not enjoy offshore revenues like the states on the other side of the Gulf.
From tires to hospital and household products, we will always need petroleum as a base. Drill now or look to $5 gas.
I’m fed up with the complaining and no action that will help us.
Joe Fanelli, Naples
Letter: Losing our Edge
Editor, Daily News:
Naples is losing its edge. How arrogant.
In a town blessed with generous and oft-times anonymous donors contributing millions of dollars annually through outright donations or via events such as the Naples Winter Wine Festival, Heart Ball, golf tournaments, galas and dinners too numerous to mention, a former “public servant” has created the illusion of a $100,000 “gift” in return for changing the name of The Edge Skatepark to the Johnny Nocera Skatepark.
The present value of the 20-year pledge approximates $50,000. Not chump change, but paltry when compared to many of the gifts presented to our community by benefactors who have waived off on naming rights.
I understand and appreciate that Nocera was one of the forces behind the skate park, but much of his staunch support of this worthy facility reflected his actions as a council member. The park is built on land donated by the Fleischmann family and was constructed with taxpayer dollars. Seems like a cheap ploy to memorialize oneself to me.
Now that we have a precedent, why stop here? How much would naming rights to the Naples Pier, Fifth Avenue South, Third Street South, Gordon Pass, Naples Bay or any of our other landmarks be worth? In these days of tough budget decisions, perhaps we should explore all our options.
The Community Services Advisory Board voted it down 6-1. I for one think City Council should rescind this ridiculous decision. By Roberts Rules, anyone voting in favor can bring it up for reconsideration. I wonder if anyone will.
Tom M. High, Naples
Letter: What’s next?
Editor, Daily News:
What folly. The Naples City Council caved in to cronyism and money and jumped aboard the “good ole boy” train and renamed a municipal property after an individual who is not deserving of such an honor normally reserved for the deceased.
The Naples City Council may as well rename The Edge Skatepark “The Al Sharpton Edge Skatepark.” The Rev. Sharpton has money, the influence and, with such a high profile, he certainly has the credibility.
OK, what’s done is done. Johnny Nocera’s ego has been sufficiently assuaged and the message sent to the world is that Naples, Florida, is for sale.
With that in mind I want the Fleischmann baseball field renamed Garland Edmonson Baseball Field. The niggling $5,000 per annum — I can swing that for 20 years, provided I live another 20 years.
So, what’s next? Will the spineless City Council allow the renaming of the street that runs just north of Nocera’s business interest on an east-west line Johnny Nocera Way?
Garland Edmonson, Naples
Letter: Don’t baby babies
Editor, Daily News:
Parents of young children seem to think that the rest of us have to placate, tolerate and submit to their children.
Not only are we supposed to put up with their kids’ endless noise in restaurants, church services, shops and airlines, but now we’re supposed to move out of the way or even off the sidewalk when they come wheeling their strollers down the path. These parents seem to think that they’ve been issued a VIP card that gives them extra privileges and rights.
Our society not only places a huge value on children, but it does so by elevating them above everyone else. We’ve all seen countless examples of parents with young children imposing their noise, drool and obnoxious behavior on the people around them, all with a haughty attitude that clearly exemplifies their self-imposed entitlement. Not only do these parents do a disservice to adults, but they are raising little monsters who will grow up and continue to believe they’re entitled to do whatever they want regardless of laws, rules and etiquette.
It’s time the rest of us stop making allowances for this rude behavior and instead of smiling and then rolling our eyes once we’re out of their view, we should let our expectations be known.
Trina Basely, Naples
Letter: Health care for all
Editor, Daily News:
In response to Joy Arpin’s guest commentary regarding health care in the United States, I am pleased her husband received excellent health care and is doing well.
I agree that some of the best care in the world is available in our country and was delighted to hear a good report about NCH’s Downtown Naples Hospital.
I would, however, like to point out that such excellent care is not available to all. As a retired nursing educator who studied other health-care delivery systems and took students abroad to experience other systems, I believe it is imperative that we who are fortunate enough to have health insurance do not become complacent.
As we go to the polls this November, we must, as responsible citizens, be aware of the needs of those who are uninsured and without access to good health care. The 2006 U.S. census figures show 47 million people without health insurance, nearly 9 million children. In Florida, over 20 percent of our population is without health insurance.
The U.S. infant mortality rate is higher than virtually every other industrialized nation in the world — including the United Kingdom and Canada.
Quality prenatal and child health care are essential if our children are to grow into healthy, productive adults and health care for all is essential for a healthy population.
The future of our country depends upon our responsibly dealing with this health-care crisis. Health care should be a right for all, not a privilege for some!
Gay J. Lindquist, R.N., M.S., Naples
Letter: Lacrosse fan
Editor, Daily News:
I wanted to recognize several local lacrosse teams for student-athlete excellence, as well as note that the Interscholastic Associates High School Boys and Girls Lacrosse State Championships are scheduled to be held at Barron Collier High School on April 25-26.
The Naples High School boys, with one game left, have a record of 10 wins and three losses. This is a huge improvement over last year.
The Bishop Verot boys are 10-4. The Barron Collier boys have one game remaining and currently have a record of 11-1, and the Barron girls finished with their first perfect season of 14-0!
The Barron boys are ranked No. 4 in the state ranking, and the Barron girls team is ranked No. 1!
The level of play this year has risen dramatically in the 15 local schools that field teams.
I hope you will take the time and effort to publicize the state final four championship series at Barron Collier High School scheduled to begin on April 25, with the finals being played on April 26.
I congratulate the teams, players, volunteer coaches, boosters and schools that have helped support the growth of lacrosse in Southwest Florida. Thank you.
Dan Cundiff, Naples
Letter: House of cards
Editor, Daily News:
We are now entering the early stage of a depression as the government and investment banks pull out two of the bottom cards in the house of cards.
They are: one, the solvency of the banking system; and two, confidence in the dollar.
The root of this evil is fiat currency, deficit spending, greed and dishonesty.
Fiat is the printing of unbacked currency. It allows government to print unlimited amounts of dollars to flood the market, creating false prosperity like housing, which is now violently crashing.
Deficit spending allows the government to fund vast social programs, earmarks, subsidies and a huge military machine, which cannot win guerilla wars, and if allowed to continue, will run into the trillions. The Treasury Department says our deficit for February is $175 billion. If that continues at that pace, our deficit for 2008 will be $1.5 trillion. This runaway debt is destroying the dollar like never before.
Greed and dishonesty involve most of the major investment banks selling toxic waste collateralized mortgage debt to the world by using questionable AAA ratings that appear to be obtained by collusion. Now, these debt obligations are virtually worthless. UBS Investment Bank estimates these collateralized debt obligations at $600 billion.
Practically everybody involved who saw this freight train coming looked the other way because of the millions in profit and bonuses, so they swept it under the rug, figuring appreciating value of real estate would bail everyone out. They thought nothing bad could happen, it’s been so good for so long.
Peter J. Meehan, Naples
Letter: Praise for “Sicko”
Editor, Daily News:
Michael Moore’s “Sicko” is a true eye-opener that should be viewed by every adult and teenager in the United States.
It is a profound review of medical care and health insurance in our rich country versus the rest of the civilized world regardless of their prosperity. It is a message of human compassion versus corporate greed, a message that should be the core of our purpose in life regardless of religious or political persuasions.
Every one of us could find ourselves in a situation as exposed here where a serious or life-threatening illness could kill us and/or devastate our families economically and emotionally. I know by personal experience.
“Sicko” is available on DVD. It is not made to be sensational, but a true conscience-awakener and informative, particularly to those who are not familiar with foreign cultures, as well as for those who have been indoctrinated that universal health care would be a disaster for capitalism.
All we are concerned about here is the health and welfare of each individual in this country — rich or poor — not the scare word “socialism,” but that we all care for each other’s well-being.
More information is available at www.sicko-themovie.com or www.michaelmoore.com.
Magnus Mortensen, Bonita Springs
Letter: Let tourists pay
Editor, Daily News:
This is about sales tax. Our Florida tax is now 6 percent and exempts most food and luxury items.
The question is, if we need more revenue, is it preferable to obtain it by raising the sales tax or by increasing real-estate taxes?
This is in defense of getting that extra money from the sales tax. The reason is very simple: Everyone buying things in Florida pays the sales tax.
Real-estate taxes are paid entirely by Floridians. Our out-of-state visitors spend a great deal on food, entertainment, etc. In almost every case, they come from states and countries that have greater sales taxes than we do; e.g., New York, 7½ percent; Canada, more than 10 percent (total of provincial plus goods and services tax).
Doesn’t it make eminent sense to let our seasonal visitors help pay for the facilities they enjoy when here? We won’t lose a single tourist because of a sales-tax increase.
Victor Oakes, Naples
Letter: Snowbirds pay
Editor, Daily News:
A letter by Arlene Nasse printed on March 31 proposes an income tax for snowbirds. How ludicrous!
First, income taxes are usually levied in the state where the income is earned, not where one vacations.
So if you favor an income tax, be prepared to pay for it yourself.
Secondly, snowbirds already pay higher property taxes while being here only part-time and they have no representation.
Thirdly, you might encourage more snowbirds to become homesteaders if you continue to tax them disproportionately. Then their contribution would be reduced, and where would the government get its revenue? You guessed it. Raise the taxes on the homesteaders.
Be careful what you wish for.
Rich Levesque , Naples and New Hampshire
Letter: Quack
Editor, Daily News:
How does this sound?
President Barack Hussein Obama. He was born a Muslim, named a Muslim and in his early days was raised Muslim.
If it walks like a duck — well, you know the rest.
Cal Roemer, Naples and Michigan
Comments
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Pssst. Semo, I'm pretty sure Brian Ross and ABC cannot order the Pentagon into battle against Iran. That responsibility lies with the tough guy from Texas.
What will be interesting is the Pentagons response if ordered into Iran. Already overburdened, it may very well be the first time in history the Commander and Chief will be ignored. LOL.
#1 Posted by boulderbilly on April 9, 2008 at 7:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Semo, additionally, if you honestly beleive the Iranians were not aware of attempts at destablizing their regime until ABC issued their report, you really do belong in Oz. Grow up.
#2 Posted by boulderbilly on April 9, 2008 at 7:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Baum,
More military deaths under Clinton than Bush jr?
It was R. Reagan who first taxed S.S.
Income tax deductions for S.S?
More tax revenues under Bush jr?
Everything in your LTE is incorrect. Do your neighbors make fun of you? I guess you wouldn't even notice.
#3 Posted by bossman1 on April 9, 2008 at 8:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Mayor Barnett owned Scotty Muffler and sold it to Johnny Nocera. Did this have anything to do with the good ol' boy network when Barnett pushed for the naming of the park?
Actually, the senior Nocera established a business in NY & little Johnny was silver spooned into it. They sold the business up north & purchased the current business from Barnett.
Nocera's history should be closely scrutinized. Did he not lie about his education? Is there anyone that is unfamiliar with his moral (or lack of) standards?
The above related letters, albeit very well written, only touch on the numerous reasons the park name should be changed. This just isn't right. What can be done?
#4 Posted by seer0603 on April 9, 2008 at 8:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Where's Vicki when we need her? I've been online gaming on a Neverwinter Nights server, slaying orcs and dragons with my longsword and Great Reaper mace.
Regarding military deaths in Iraq, I don't even pay attention to the numbers anymore. I read a couple of years ago that the numbers of dead and wounded, like the numbers of those struck ill by "the mysterious illness" they claime was pneumonis, were deliberately under-reported. Like a soldier that gets hit by a round or shrapnel, but dies during the medevac doesn't get counted as a KIA.
I had heard that the military did something similar during the Persian Gulf War, and that the 148 KIAs was grossly inaccurate.
I'll have to see if I can dig up some information on the subject, maybe do a story on it. In the meantime, if anyone is interested the Soldiers For The Truth (www.sftt.org) is a good site for infor on the military and the war. GulfBlink, Kirk Love's brainchild, is another good site for info and news regarding the first gulf war and also some on the current one. I would also recommend reading David Hackworth's "Hazardous Duty" if you're interested in some of the fun and follies of war ranging from the Persian Gulf War to Bosnia. Also Mr. Hackworth did a weekly column on DefenseWatch; archived at Soldiers For The Truth.
#5 Posted by Illiar on April 9, 2008 at 9:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
"cut and paste" is at it again. Not one original thought or his head may explode. LOL.
#6 Posted by boulderbilly on April 9, 2008 at 10:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
The amount of disinformation and misinformation posted in the Letters to the Editor and in the subsequent blogs is absolutely staggering and cannot simply be done out of ignorance, although I do suspect that ignorance plays a large part.
For instance... please go to:
www.snopes.com
and type in Social Security. At the end of the most pertinent entry are links to Social Security Administration websites dealing with "myths".
On second thought... nevermind... why bother?... carry on.
#7 Posted by AARGGHHH on April 9, 2008 at 10:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Has anyone else noticed that the letter written by James Dale yesterday (April 8th) and titled "Misprint", is the only letter not on the NDN internet site? (I checked this carefully, the others are there.) It was about a grammatical mistake made by Gulf Coast University President, Wilson Bradshaw at his inauguration. He evidently said, "Walk with me and walk good." Wonder why it was deleted?
#8 Posted by cumberlandgal on April 10, 2008 at 12:02 a.m. (Suggest removal)
How about a fifty word limit on this "Comments" column?
Comment (Webster): "A note or observation..."
#9 Posted by oremus on April 10, 2008 at 6:03 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Ed Gross...I too notice that not all obey the law of "if your windshield wipers are on, so must your lights be on". What what can you do? Drive carefully and defensively.
#10 Posted by eaglebeak on April 10, 2008 at 7:07 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Trina Basely;
WOW! Aren't you just a big sweetheart.
What's next? An article about euthanizing puppies and kitties?
I guess since the world was sooo blessed with your presence here, they should have stopped making babies till you leave this world.
Maybe somebody needs to go into the forest and look for your gingerbread house trimmed with candy!!
You have a problem with baby strollers?? What's the matter, you have a hard time taking 1 step to the side? Infringes on your right to walk a straight, uninterrupted path? I guess the elderly that have the audacity to need wheelchairs and walkers must be a huge problem for you, also.
Personally, I do elevate babies above the rest of society. You see, they are young and haven't developed a hatred for people, yet. Maybe if I can somehow make a tiny difference, they won't grow up so arrogant that they think society needs to get out of their way so they can walk in a straight, uninterrupted path.
#11 Posted by Optipess on April 10, 2008 at 7:27 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Can you think of one area of conflict,be it immigration,energy,health care,etc,where it's not distilled down to
a conflict between our current form of constitution-based,rule of law,quasi-democratic republic government
and our true (unpoken,unwritten)'religion'...aka. free market capitalism? We got us a pickle.
#12 Posted by weality on April 10, 2008 at 8:45 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Nina.......further reflection on your comment yesterday about the establishment of Ave Maria University town...your country has been an example of how assimilation has followed the establishment of similar places..look to Notre Dame University...Oral Roberts University...the Mormons of Salt Lake city and several other religious groups which started as separate entities and grew to diverse towns and cities.so don't be so quick to judge Ave Maria...history will prove it will become a diversified town
#13 Posted by Canuck on April 10, 2008 at 9:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Trina,
Your description of drooling, obnoxious and incontinent people sounds more to me like the happy hour crowd at any 5th Avenue restaurant.
#14 Posted by BobbyBacala on April 10, 2008 at 9:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Canuck -
From yesterday: One of the things that bothers me about huge opulent churches, temples, mosques or whatever is the amount of slave labor used to build these large monstrositys. It takes a lot of money to build these structures, and a lot of it comes from people who don't have enough to live on in the first place.
In many poor countries of the world, there are monstrous places of worship surrounded by poverty stricken people who are required to give so much of their meager amount of money to the church.
When the Spanish Padres came to the Western Hemisphere, they forced the "pagan" natives to become Catholic and if they refused, they were tortured and killed. I'm sure the Catholic Church has reformed, but I would have a hard time belonging to a church with such a cruel history.
I'm sure Mother Teresa did a lot of good work, but if the church would teach birth control, there wouldn't be so many downtrodden poor waifs in the first place. The church teaches against birth control and for large families, which is ruining the Earth.
I'm not picking on you, Canuck, beacuse you can't help what your church has done. You can believe what you want, but I don't belong to any church. I can be a good citizen without being indoctrinated in any religion. We'd probably be better off without religions. Religions divide people and if all the money spent on religions would be used to help suffering people, there wouldn't be any need for religious charity.
The world needs to hear more about birth control. There are too many children living in poverty.
If the Catholic Church was the only church, there would once again be lots of poverty and there would be lots of intolerance and persecution to anyone who dared stand up against the authority of the church. The reason the church has reformed is it had to because of the enlightenment. If the enlightenment were taken away, the church would revert back to it's former cruel and authoritarian ways. We would have the dark ages all over again.
#15 Posted by rationalman on April 10, 2008 at 9:56 a.m. (Suggest removal)
FreeSpeech,
I agree with you that Guilty's post #8 was an excellent piece. I don't always agree with him, but in this, he is right on the money.
I'm going to ask you and other bloggers to stop calling thundermcgee McGoo and twisting other posters' names in a childish effort to demean them. It's really, really old now and does nothing to enhance your credibility.
We're all adults on here, and there are important things to discuss. Let's call a truce now and treat each other with respect.
#16 Posted by Nina6520 on April 10, 2008 at 10:01 a.m. (Suggest removal)
TRINA BASELY,
Are you serious? What box did you come from? You made some very nasty and down right ignorant statements. If anything, you need one of those children to wrap their tiny little arms around you and give you a sticky-faced kiss on your cheek as they say "I wub you".
#17 Posted by zygolo on April 10, 2008 at 10:37 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Trina: Here's what you should have written becuase it is more accurate:
"We’ve all seen countless examples of senior citizens imposing their noise, drool and obnoxious behavior on the people around them, all with a haughty attitude that clearly exemplifies their self-imposed entitlement."
Remember this when you get your social security check next month, and who is funding your retirement.
#18 Posted by roadhouse on April 10, 2008 at 10:57 a.m. (Suggest removal)
In his letter in today's NDN, Cal Roemer attempts to smear Barack Obama because of his name and part of his family's putative religious heritage.
Let's turn the tables for a moment. What do we find when we look up the derivation of the names "Roemer" and "Cal?"
One meaning of the name Roemer is "braggart," from the German. Are we to conclude that the nastiness of this letter writer is that of a self-important Nazi?
The surname "Cal" was often given in honor of the French Protestant theologian Jean Calvin (1509-64). It originally meant “little bald one."
Calvin was a particularly stirct and intolerant religious reformer.
Perhaps Cal Roemer should be careful how he construes names and family religious affiliation lest he be regarded as an intolerant, strutting peacock of a little bald Nazi.
#19 Posted by r2winslow on April 10, 2008 at 10:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Great post, rationalman, you have reiteratd a point I was trying to make yesterday - that we should not be advocating the building of religiously exclusive towns. Can you imagine the outcry if we tried to build an atheist town? Remember, atheism is officially a religion.
We should also be encouraging people to practice birth-control as there are already too many people in the world and resources are dwindling. I don't think the Mormon example is one we would want to follow - lots of wives, lots of children and lots of secrecy - hardly a lifestyle to emulate in a country striving for equity and diversity.
#20 Posted by Nina6520 on April 10, 2008 at 11:28 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Ok
If anyone was going to get us in bed with the Muslims it was George W Bush. He has long time ties to the Suadi Royal Family. That is fact i dont have to give links for everyone to see it.
It is well documented in the 9/11 Commission files. His father was having lunch with Osama Bin Laden's family during the 9/11 Attacks. Then he invaded a country in the middle east and put a flame to a fire that started hundreds of years ago.
About Barack Obama. If the rest of the election is going to be about Obama's ties to radical churches an so on. I have to tell you Obama is a politician and will be endorsed by shady characters.
I can endorse him. I can be the worst person in the world. Until he finds out that i endorsed him, or it doesnt benefit him to find out. He will not say "I dont believe in what NaplesTaco says"
That is the same thing that every politician says. Politics is like that.
If you are worried about Muslims. Think about the "Sons of Iraq" that we are now paying for. A terrorist group turned militia.
Obama wants to talk to Iran. Why? Because we are in Iraq. Iran and Iraq are neighbors. Iran and Iraq are dealing with eachother.
How did we bring down the soviet union?
Iran is completing its nuclear program.
We can not leave Iraq until 2009 2010 because of Iran.
#21 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 11:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Re Cal Roemer's letter about Obama being Muslim: I know Cal Roemer, and he's a very nice person, So I called him to alleviate his fears.
The problem is, who is spreading these lies about Obama, so that ordinary nice people believe it?
How many times do we have to set this record straight. Barack is not a Muslim and never was. His father who left him when Barack was 2, went back to Kenya. Barack never knew him. Barack's mother and grand parents were Catholic, and although Barack's mother eventually fell away from Catholicism, she did not become any other religion, and especially not Muslim.
When Barack's Mother who was going to college in Hawaii met Barack's step father, they moved to Indonesia for a few years because his mother's second husband was called back for some government service. Barack went to a public school in Indonesia from 6 years old to 10. In the school were Christians, Jews and Muslims, however, since Indonesia is heavily Muslim, there were more Muslim students in the school.
At 10 Barack's mother left divorced her husband and left, and they returned to the states. Barack was raised by his White mother and White Grandparents, non of them were Muslim.
Barack embraced Christianity when he entered the church of which Rev. Wright was minister in Chicago. Barack's becoming an active Christian meant a lot to him, and for that he is greatful to the Rev. Wright.
Barack has overcome much discrimination he's been confronted with because of race and his Muslim Name. I applaud him for his fortitude in going forward and accomplishing much in spite of all those obstacles. And because he understands so much about all of these things, race, religion etc. he wants to bring us together, so we will not hate each other for non valid reasons of race, instead of who we are and what we do.
#22 Posted by truthmatters on April 10, 2008 at 12:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Jaggedsoldier, only you could come up with something so ridiculous as Obama = Anti Christ?
If you're into looking for an Anti Christ, I think you might look at the present Washington D.C. There might be even more than one there.
They've done about enough to bring on the End Times, and being they haven't left yet, they may bring on Armageddon yet.
As far as this anti Semitism thing goes. What's your problem with Muslims caring about Muslims? Don't we care about our own people, our Christians? We certainly voice plenty loudly our feelings about any body we feel has wronged us.
It's no secret that the Muslims and the Jews are having some terrible differences. This has been since the beginning. There are justifiable complaints on both sides.
What Obama wants to try to do is mend those differences so they can live in peace. We can't make head way by blanketedly hating one side and loving the other. If we do that, there will never be any solution.
What should be done is, remove the names from every event and look at it in a totally objective manner so one can, without prejudice, make a fair judgment.
What complaints are valid and which are not can be assessed. There will have to be some solid, well thought out plan to follow, and this should be drawn up by impartial outside parties. This plan then should be submitted to all the people involved. Those who dismiss it will be sanctioned. Those who accept it will be rewarded. We cannot ourselves solve the differences between Israelis and Palestinians.
But Barack will try. Maybe, he can gain enough trust to do so.
#23 Posted by truthmatters on April 10, 2008 at 12:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Trina, let me guess. You live in an over 55 gated community. You get upset if visiting grandchildren are using "your" pool and heaven forbid laughing and splashing and having any fun. Right?? You're lucky enough to live in beautiful Naples and yet you and people like you will always find something to complain about. How very sad.
#24 Posted by Coler on April 10, 2008 at 12:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)
look at post #29 for humor and #33 for truth
#25 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 12:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Good post rationalman #22
#26 Posted by NEOPTERA on April 10, 2008 at 1:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Rationalman....what makes you think the churches etc were built with "slave labour"...in small towns etc the churches are built by people who have love of their religion and use their sweat and yes their money to build a place to worship...you talk of big churches built in areas where there is poverty..these places were built many years ago by people with money and we are now in different times....in most cases the upkeep of these churches is supported by faithful from more wealthy congregations
why do you always go back to ancient times to point out the bad eras of the church...bad men did bad things in the name of many religions but lets live at least in modern times and you will not discover a Catholic missionary under every non-believer's bed
as for birth control ..this is one of the basic tenets of the church and regardless of its detractors the church will never succumb to abortion as a form of birth control which is now practiced most openly in yours and my country
the sacrement of marriage is based upon the procreation of children but then I would not expect people without faith to understand
in your country as in mine there are long lines of families waiting to adopt and some have been forced to go to 3rd world countrys because there are not enough children in theirs to adopt...especially when you look at the number of abortions
so as I said to Nina if the world poor concerns you so much be an activist where trillions of dollars are spent on weapons and wars...which dollars could cure all the ills in the world if they were used for good
#27 Posted by Canuck on April 10, 2008 at 1:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
well said truth
#28 Posted by akennedy on April 10, 2008 at 1:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Actually, the Church's policy against birth control isn't rooted in morality. It's rooted in politics. Overpopulation in poor countries perpetuates miserable living conditions; which is the ideal breeding ground for conservative Catholicism. The Church actually thrives on poverty.
#29 Posted by NEOPTERA on April 10, 2008 at 1:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I see a lot of talk about church and state these days.
Let me remind all. Abe Lincoln had no church. He was one of our greatest presidents.
Lincoln's speeches and conversation revealed a spiritual perception far above the ordinary. It is one of the great ironies of the history of Christianity in America that the most profoundly religious analysis of the nation's deepest trauma came not from a clergyman or a theologian but from a politician who was self-taught in the ways of both God and humanity. The source of Lincoln's Christian perception will probably always remain a mystery, but the unusual depth of that perception none can doubt. Nowhere was that depth more visible than in his Second Inaugural Address of March 1865: "Both [North and South] read the same Bible, and pray to the same God; and each invokes His aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God's assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men's faces; but let us judge not that we be not judged. The prayers of both could not be answered; that of neither has been answered fully. The Almighty has His own purposes." Even more to the point was his reply when a minister from the North told the president he "hoped the Lord is on our side." Responded Lincoln, "I am not at all concerned about that. . . . But it is my constant anxiety and prayer that I and this nation should be on the Lord's side."
By entangling ourselves into a denomination sometimes we bind ourselves into contracts that are eternal for all.
Seperation of Church and State is essential.
#30 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 1:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)
actually jagged. there are many who believe that the anti christ will be the last pope.
#31 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 1:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
actually jagged. there are many who believe that the anti christ will be the last pope.
#32 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 1:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
NEOPTERA...say what you will as a non-believer but birth control is a moral issue within the Catholic church...and a moral issue with all protesant churches until 1930..so you are ill informed or just bias when you post a statement as in # 39
"The Church also has affirmed that the illicitness of contraception is an infallible doctrine: "The Church has always taught the intrinsic evil of contraception, that is, of every marital act intentionally rendered unfruitful. This teaching is to be held as definitive and irreformable. Contraception is gravely opposed to marital chastity, it is contrary to the good of the transmission of life (the procreative aspect of matrimony), and to the reciprocal self-giving of the spouses (the unitive aspect of matrimony); it harms true love and denies the sovereign role of God in the transmission of human life" (Vademecum for Confessors 2:4, Feb. 12, 1997).
#33 Posted by Canuck on April 10, 2008 at 1:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I believe that anybody that relies on a book, be it the Bible, the Koran, the Talmud, the I-Ching or any other has their head so far up their rectal cavity they will never see truth.
ALL Humans are from the same beginning, we share the same DNA, therefore we share the same ends no matter what Dogmas we subscribe to along the way.
I'm going to guess that not one Dogma has ever been correct.
#34 Posted by cupcake on April 10, 2008 at 1:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)
CANUCK. The Church did not solidify it's position against abortion until 1869. (Pope Pius IX)
As difficult as it may seem, the Church actually condoned a very liberal approach to early-term abortion for most of it's history. John Paul II was wrong when he said otherwise.
#35 Posted by NEOPTERA on April 10, 2008 at 1:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Previously, Pope Gregory XIII said it was not homicide to kill an embryo of less then 40 days because it was not human. Furthermore, the difference in size of an embryo of 38 days is negligible, so they certainly knew there was something substantial in the womb beforehand. Also, you might be surprised to find what St. Augustine, Thomas Aquinas, Popes Innocent III and Gregory XIV had to say about the humanity of the unborn, while for centuries the Church debated the gravity of the sin of abortion relative to different stages of embryonic development.
#36 Posted by NEOPTERA on April 10, 2008 at 2 p.m. (Suggest removal)
THE REASON THE CHURCH WAS LATE ON CONDEMNING ABORTION: During the squalid Middle Ages, poor people and the mistresses of Catholic nobility and the clergy were constantly pregnant or always in danger of becoming so. This lack of effective birth control resulted in more mouths to feed , inconvenient pregnancies, and the ongoing problem plaguing the Church in caring for abandoned babies left on its doorstep.
#37 Posted by NEOPTERA on April 10, 2008 at 2:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Rev 13:11 - And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
Like a Lamb - of Christ
Two Horns - Two horned mitre. The pontifs hat.
Speaks like a Dragon - The bible speaks of the Devil in the garden of Eden as a dragon. Therefore speaking like a dragon would be lies.
This is revelation.
#38 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 2:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)
my own belief.
no.
the pope is not the anti-christ
it is just another conspiracy theory.
I believe the anti christ is man.
Hitler. Castro. Putin. The anti christ spirit is alive and well and will eventually grow to a boiling point until gods good spirit cleans the earth. (second coming)
The second coming will be fire and brimstone and will be entire brought on by our own action. We have free will and will bring this upon ourselves. We also have the opportunity to not have armaggetton happen. Unfortunatley the major players are greed, envy, lust and sloth.
I just saw a wonderful movie.
There Will Be Blood.
The bible was written by men, some with divine light others with divine profit. Put together by a roman dictator for rule. It began the Catholic Church.
I would love to be a fly on the wall during Constatine's meetings.
#39 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 2:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)
NEOPTERA.....coincide your statements with the following proclamations fron the early church fathers.....recent statements only confirm the tenet that has been with the church from the beginning
The biblical teaching that birth control is wrong is found even more explicitly among the Church Fathers, who recognized the biblical and natural law principles underlying the condemnation.
In A.D. 195, Clement of Alexandria wrote, "Because of its divine institution for the propagation of man, the seed is not to be vainly ejaculated, nor is it to be damaged, nor is it to be wasted" (The Instructor of Children 2:10:91:2).
Hippolytus of Rome wrote in 255 that "on account of their prominent ancestry and great property, the so-called faithful [certain Christian women who had affairs with male servants] want no children from slaves or lowborn commoners, [so] they use drugs of sterility or bind themselves tightly in order to expel a fetus which has already been engendered" (Refutation of All Heresies 9:12).
The First Council of Nicaea, the first ecumenical council and the one that defined Christ’s divinity, declared in 325, "If anyone in sound health has castrated himself, it behooves that such a one, if enrolled among the clergy, should cease [from his ministry], and that from henceforth no such person should be promoted. But, as it is evident that this is said of those who willfully do the thing and presume to castrate themselves, so if any have been made eunuchs by barbarians, or by their masters, and should otherwise be found worthy, such men this canon admits to the clergy" (Canon 1).
Augustine wrote in 419, "I am supposing, then, although you are not lying [with your wife] for the sake of procreating offspring, you are not for the sake of lust obstructing their procreation by an evil prayer or an evil deed. Those who do this, although they are called husband and wife, are not; nor do they retain any reality of marriage, but with a respectable name cover a shame. Sometimes this lustful cruelty, or cruel lust, comes to this, that they even procure poisons of sterility [oral contraceptives]" (Marriage and Concupiscence 1:15:17).
#40 Posted by Canuck on April 10, 2008 at 2:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Canuck,
The starving people of Africa do not care about the sanctity of marriage or about the "reciprocal self-giving of the spouses". You have to live in a developed country where you don't have to worry about starving to death or dying of AIDS for that. If contraception is "contrary to the good of the transmission of life", explain the utter misery and suffering that ensues. It's the children who suffer - doesn't that matter to you? Is the idea that God creates all life so important to you that you can ignore the hideous realities of overpopulation?
Most of the illegal immigrants are Catholic, but they are having babies out of wedlock at a rate of knots. They don't seem too bothered about the church's stance on that since it doesn't suit their purposes.
Don't you see how ridiculous your argument is? Life is not a wonderful gift from God if it is short and painful.
As for your Pope making laws and insisting they are infallible - more fool those who allow him to dictate to them about the size of the families they, not he, must raise.
No one ever suggested the church should accept abortion as a form of birth control. Where did that come from? Prevention of contraception can be equated with the prevention of suffering. NEOPTERA is right - it has nothing to do with morality and everything to do with filling the pews.
#41 Posted by Nina6520 on April 10, 2008 at 2:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I see I am being challenged on two sides so let me deal with NEOPTERA's statements in posts 48 &49 and completely disregard # 50
if you are posting statements which you claim as fact please give your sources as I have bio-ed both Popes Gregory and Innocent as well as the "problem Pope Pius" and see nothing where they condone abortion or birth control
we have already seen what Augustine has said which refutes your statement
#42 Posted by Canuck on April 10, 2008 at 2:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Guilty.
how does Obama encourage or support the union of Church and State?
#43 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 3:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Nina....why are you blaming the Catholic church for "all the starving children" in Africa ...I would suggest to you the vast majority are muslims and have easy access to various methods of birth control.yet the birth rate continues and AIDS is still very prevelant
as for your illegal immigrants if they are having babies out of wedlock in a country which has many avenues of birth control what makes you think they are following the teachings of the church
I don't expect you to understand Jesus' words to Peter...the first Pope "what you render on earth will be rendered in heaven"
this is when he speaks on dogmas of faith.
as for the church and abortian ...read NEOPTERA's claims...that's where it came from
as for your claim the church is promoting promiscuity among 3rd nation youth to "swell the ranks" that is just a paranoid stupid statement right up there with some of McCarthy's communist statements
and what about all those parents who want to adopt but there is such a waiting list they have to go to other countries...no comment?
#44 Posted by Canuck on April 10, 2008 at 3:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
JaggedSoldier, you brought up the Anti-Christ thing. I merely said, if you're looking for one, you might find one right now in D.C.
I never said I believed in an Anti-Christ or Armageddon. You know, that's the trouble with you war mongering, right wingers. You can't understand anything. You just put your thoughts into everything and don't listen to a darn thing, and that's why you never learn.
And Oldtimer. Once and for all. BARACK OBAMA IS NOT A MUSLIM AND NEVER, NEVER WAS A MUSLIM. Now quit you're dang lying. What's the matter with you people? If you believe at all in the 10 commandments, it's a sin to lie. Got that. It's a sin to lie, to bear false witness. I think Barack should start suing some of you liars for slander. Maybe that would shut your mouths.
Now, if you can't say anything of substance about Obama that is factual other than your made up crap, then shut your mouths. You may have the right of free speech, but that does not include outright slander.
Your bigotry shows big time, and it pretty well describes what kind of people you are, and if you're religious at all, what makes you think God approves of that?
#45 Posted by truthmatters on April 10, 2008 at 3:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Letter: Bedeviled
"I had never seen the stage production or movie and had been looking so forward to seeing it at the Philharmonic Center for the Arts...As well, a more traditional versus modern version of the production would have been far more appealing...I was extremely disappointed and came away wondering why I went."
Joan O’Connor, Naples
Ummm - Joan?
Jesus Christ Superstar is a ROCK opera - that IS the "version" of the production. Since you weren't familiar with it, how could you possibly even assume that there was another version? Any small amount of research would have told you what the show is and that the show was premiered in 1971 AS a modern musical theatre production of a rock opera. I'm sorry that the production was so loud (that seems to be a common complaint about The Phil), but to be disappointed in a production b/c you didn't know anything about it is silly. If you are attending the theatre & don't know much about the particular show - ASK. That way, you can determine whether you should take the risk of going & complaining later about something that makes you sound ridiculous.
#46 Posted by stagemgr on April 10, 2008 at 3:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)
you are who
who you are
#47 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 4:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Jagged
Can you give me a solid explanation for paying a government contract to the "Sons of Iraq"?
I am not Bush bashing. I am Petrayus bashing maybe a little McCain bashing.
#48 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 4:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
#49 Posted by truthmatters on April 10, 2008 at 4:54 p.m.
Guitly
Have you read the book?
Or did you find these quotes off a web site?
This is a direct quote from NaplesTaco
I will stand with Muslims in this time of political shift and turmoil.
What does that tell you?
That i am not going to join the witch hunt of a belief. Because there are extremist factions that want to destroy me.
Both of Baracks books let you view his life. But you have to read them.
I NaplesTaco have a Jewish name. I am not Jewish. I was raised catholic took my communion. I am not catholic. I have read about Buddha. I am not Buddist.
If you take me for the first two years. I am a jew. But i am not. If you take me for what my parents wanted me to be i am a catholic. But i am not. If you take me for my adolencence i am born again, but i am not. If you take me for my college years i am buddist, unitarian.
Barack Obama grew into himself. And gave you the gift of reading about it.
It might be a generational thing.
#50 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 6:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Guilty
Your Obama link goes to a smear page that is written by one blogger, Election08, with a lot of false claims.
#51 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 6:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)
How many belive that Jagged and Guilty are pathological liars?? How many saw them caught in a blatant lie about military deaths?
I'd say Obama has much more credibility then you two losers. He can admit when he is wrong. You two are caught in a blatant lie, which everyone who reads this forum knows, and yet you accuse other's of being dishonest? I sure hope you don't have kids, all we need is more liars like you in our society. To think some poor child might have one of you two for a role model, God help them...
#52 Posted by er0001 on April 10, 2008 at 6:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)
http://www.israpundit.com/2008/?p=370
i found your blogsite here
stop smearing and research.
The books tell a tale of an immigrant orphan. Given a chance to make a change.
I want to know the real reason why you dont want Obama in office.
Do you have a real fear of the Muslim faith?
Do you think shari-ala is coming to the United States?
Again Guilty..
I found your smear site
http://www.israpundit.com/2008/?p=370
Please build your posts, especially when you are attempting to tear down an individual on your own personal thoughts and notions.
It is very easy to get fooled and misled these days.
just look at operation iraqi freedom.
#53 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 6:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I know whats going on in Kenya.
Kenya has been one of the most stable countries in Africa. Based on tribal lords and Muslim culture.
recently there were hotly contested elections where Raila "Lou" Odinga was involved.
Lou claims to be Obama's cousin on his father's side. However Obama has not met his father. Nor has he met Lou. Lou high aspirations naming a son after Fidel Castro as well.
Obama visited Kenya. His native country in 2006. During a world trip and took and aids test with his wife and dressed up in native garb.
He is very popular in Africa..
Hmm i wonder why? Black American President?
#54 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 6:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Guilty
the more i follow your links the more you expose yourself as extreme.
Again. The internet is a very dangerous place where anyone can say anything. Please be careful where you get your sources and be responsible who you spread them to.
Unless you have another motive.
Then be foward with it, because once exposed, the color will be dark as night.
If you are afraid of extreme muslims being an exreme zionist or whatever makes you no better.
#55 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 6:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)
HELLLOOOOOO!!!!!!
OBAMA ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LIL' DICK CHENEY ONLY SHOOTS STRAIGHT WHEN AIMING FOR A FRIEND.
#56 Posted by boulderbilly on April 10, 2008 at 7:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Jagged
I think that you and i are on different spectrums of the political field.
However, i think that we both want the best for our country.
Check out this blogsite.
http://www.longwarjournal.org/archive...
read it. and let me know sometime what you think.
It is the best information that i can find on
the "Sons of Iraq". Which is a militia in Iraq that we are going to contract to help our soldiers find weapons and fight the war.
I dont trust it. But it might be necessary.
But i dont trust it. It must be horrible being a soldier with boots on the ground right now.
Get back to me sometime after reading about it.
http://www.longwarjournal.org/archive...
#57 Posted by NaplesTaco on April 10, 2008 at 7:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Jaded is a delusional tough guy soldier just like our esteemed President. LOL. The only difference is he would have been charged for going AWOL, unlike his heroes that are puttin' the screws to him and the rest of America. Hey Lil' Dick, ya ain't gettin' no deferments from the historians. He and the puss from Texas are both goin' down as the worst and weakest leaders in US history.
#58 Posted by boulderbilly on April 10, 2008 at 7:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)
When folks are needin' to visit the talkin' Dr., they tend to hear and see things that are not there.
I've always posted under boulderbilly, so be a good sick vet and take your meds jaded.
BOOOO!!!! Just kiddin'. Put down the water pistol.
Thing's will get better in Jan. '09 jaded when the guy with socks stashed down his flight suit goes home to Texas. That poor village in Texas has been missin' its idiot long enough.
#59 Posted by boulderbilly on April 10, 2008 at 8:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Guilty hit the nail on the head.
Perhaps McCain, Bushey Boy, and Lil' Dick can all go huntin' together when the neocon shortbus heads west next Jan. I just hope Jr. and John know not to wear orange vests. Lil' Dick thinks that's the bulls eye. He's only capable of shooting his foot and best friends.
If only he had not taken all those deferments he could have learned to shoot in Viet Nam with the rest of the real men.
#60 Posted by boulderbilly on April 10, 2008 at 8:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Guilty and all of you who are slandering Obama, I read both of his books and came away with a great respect for him. I saw nothing in those books that led me to be worried or even suspicious of him.
He has a very interesting background and is very intelligent. The school in Indonesia was a public school. I don't know why some of you insist that it was some kind of Muslim indoctrinated school. There were Jews, Christians and others besides Muslims in the secular school.
It does no one any good to twist Barack's background or to lie about his intentions. Anyone can make up anything or instill suspicions about anyone, but not until you have thoroughly read both of Obama's books can you have a true picture of the man. Snippets gleaned out of context here and there only mislead the public, and why do you want to do that? The truth is what we look for, not concoctions of people's minds who hold a preconceived bigotry.
Thank you NaplesTaco, you have been great. It's really heartening when I see the people on the blogs who are not the radical right, predjudice hawks who seem to be devoid of heart.
#61 Posted by truthmatters on April 10, 2008 at 8:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)
What is your major malfunction, JaggedSoldier? Does it matter what I do with my computer?
#62 Posted by Illiar on April 10, 2008 at 8:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)
You know, it's occurred to me that if we quit wearing our individual religions on our sleeves we may get a little more agreement about a direction which makes sense, economically and spiritually.
#63 Posted by almasonlybar on April 10, 2008 at 8:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)
thunder, are you not aware of the neocons favorite tactic? Whenever they confront someone that is a tad more intelligent, they automatically brand the individual as "unAmerican." It is Carl Rove's forte'. The sad thing is the illegitimates have done more to destroy this countries prestige than all other administrations combined. Just listen to them trying to justify torture during "extreme times."
I guess when WE SHOT military officers for waterboarding prisoners, the Japanese were not justified in the tactic.
I dunno. Just seems what's good for the goose is good for the gander. Perhaps it is time to bring back the firing squad for those authorizing and practicing torture. We can even use Lil' Dick as the shooter until it's his time to face the music.
#64 Posted by boulderbilly on April 10, 2008 at 8:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Helped us in our time of need thunder? Perhaps the SOB would let us into the northwest region to whack Osama if he was a real friend.
I just love who the neocons pick as friends.
Thunder, please explain why Musharraf and his top scientist, Khan, was a benefit to our strategic interests. How exactly does the sharing of technical info. with those interested in an Islamic bomb benefit the US?
Hey, he's your guy, you've personally backed him Guilty, so please explain to me why the conservatives have invested soooo much US prestige in this tin pot illegitimate.
We're waiting with baited breath.
#65 Posted by boulderbilly on April 10, 2008 at 9:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
CANUCK was correct when he quoted the anti-abortion writings of the Church Fathers.
From Post 54
My point was that as time went by neither the clergy, the rich, or the poor could live up to the high standards set by these Fathers in the first few centuries c.e.
Today, the Church uses pro-life as a moral rallying cry (sort of like- Remember the Alamo) to unify the faithful in response to a growing secular world. It’s pro-life stance is simply a political move cloaked in a veil of morality. Church history is full of this kind of strategy. For instance, the witch hunts of the 1500s were probably started to divert people’s attention away from the abuses brought to light by Martin Luther. All those women, hideously tortured, not as a moral defense against the devil, -but for politics.
#66 Posted by NEOPTERA on April 10, 2008 at 9:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)
thunder, I know it's gotta be blasted near impossible but please back up who you claim are our friends.
How does Musharraf giving nuclear secrets to the highest Islamic bidder further our interests? Perhaps like harboring Osama?
You think you're pretty sharp Einstein/thunder. Answer the freakin question.
Ya may wanna look up eunuch in the dictionary.
#67 Posted by boulderbilly on April 10, 2008 at 9:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Bo